Why do people subtitle movies?

[manu44434]

Hi there,
I am an avid user of the peer to peer file sharing system and I regularly need to find specific subtitles for some films or TV series. So there is no need to explain me the needs for a platform like opensubtitles. I am curious though. Why do people go through the process of subtitling a whole movie? This represents clearly a lot of work and there has to be some kind of motivation, conviction before getting into such work.
Basically, this is just an open question to anybody who has already uploaded his own subtitles on a platform like opensubtitles:
Why have you done that?
Is it because you loved the movie and you wanted as many people as possible to see it?
Is there some kind of self esteem improvement here, like "I am able to translate a whole movie"?
Are you convinced that the web should be a platform for sharing everything for free, no matter what (like copyright infringement for example), and you want to take part in this revolution?
Do you expect something in return?
Is it that you feel you're not useful to the society in your daily life, and this is a kind of charity work for you?

I dont' know... It's just that so many people contribute to these subtitles, in so many countries... There is probably a pattern somewhere and I would be curious to spot it.

(I am not an undercover HADOPI detective, just an individual with this question in my head for the past 48 hours)

[SmallBrother]

We get this kind of questions once in a while.
Yeah, sometimes some parts of life are incomprehendable for some people.
Before I would reply to your post more thoroughly, I would first like to see that you come back to this forum

[manu44434]

oh i am coming back. no worries about that.
i am genuinely interested by this topic.

[SmallBrother]

Okay, I will try to tell you why I am doing what I am doing. Which is by the way not a reflection of OpenSubtitles.org in general nor any other individual subtitler.

Sometimes I made subs for a movie, just because of making people happy. I have made subs for 'popular' main-stream movies, which isn't even that great or something special. In such case it's nice to make a lot of people happy with just a bit of my time.

In other cases I think the movie is great, inspiring and well worth watching, for a great story, and/or some 'messages' within. For example "Into the Wild" or the much less known French movie "La Belle Verte", which is pretty damn funny too, by the way. Here the time involved was much more, and the number of downloads much less, but if it helps to have just one person open his/her eyes or look into a different direction, it was well worth it.

In other cases, it's simply a hobby. Making subs (translating as well as making good timings) is something creative and the process of making is fun, and if the result is something of decent quality, that's a satisfying reward.

I am definately into sharing. The internet is still partly a medium of sharing, and I don't specifically think things should be shared for free, but I *do* think sharing things only if they are (well) paid is not a very well working system. I need to pay my bills, but there's nothing wrong (at all) with doing things without being paid. On the contrary, think about it: imagine everyone would work for free... It would be one way to solve the 'crisis' instantly.

Sometimes, something is legal, but immoral. Or the other way around. Typically, laws are temporary, limited by location, and it's protection is pretty limited. Morality however is universal, timeless and protects in my humble opinion higher values. So, rather than considering the legal aspect, I prefer to consider morality. I think making subs is not immoral. And I think Coline Serreau wouldn't mind So no, me making subs is not being a revolutionary rebel, I'm just living my way.

Although a simple "thank you" is nice (I'm only human), I don't expect anything from others in return. The reward is in the result. Besides, expectations are only a road to disappointments and therefore not a very smart system.

Now you made me wonder too, and I have some questions for you.

What makes you think it is 'strange' what we are doing? What makes you think that "self esteem improvement" could be a/the motivation? I mean, do you also wonder why a plumber is plumbing, as in "I am able to fix that drain" or a painter painting ("I am able to draw an apple")? And what makes you think that our subtitles is "charity" and that this (or any) charity could be a way to compensate for a feeling of not being useful to society in daily life?

[Hunnenkoenig]

I do it, when I am bored and want to do something else, than what I do every day.

I translate only movies, which are blockbusters and highly wanted, but they have no available english subtitles, which can be used by half educated barbarians to make crappy translations.
I hate it, when people, who can't even speak their own language and don't even have a general knowledge about anything, create awful translations, which have nothing to do with the original story and then they even brag about it.
So I try to pass them, so people can enjoy the movie with a proper subtitle in the first place.

Of course I also have to like the movie and it must have touched me somehow.
Otherwise it is too much work.

If people thank me, I appreciate it, but I am not holding my breath for it :-)

I just enjoy the process and I am happy if I see, how many people downloaded it.

[manu44434]

Hi SmallBrother and Hunnenkoening,

Thanks for your replies.

It is not that 'strange' what you are doing. I understand the good will and the benefits of sharing. It is just that I have never actively formatted a movie I own and uploaded it on the web. I have never done something like that (on the internet I mean, in the real world, I am trying to be nice and helpful with my surroundings), and I am wondering what triggers it.
For the self esteem, any personal project you do will be another brick added to your "self". the plumber is plumbing because he has learned to do it and he is good at it. I wouldn't be surprised that he decides to set up on his own the best plumbing installation in his own home, just because he knows how to do it. The painter will draw an apple and will probably be proud of it. If he was ashamed of his work, he would stop. So I am not wondering why the plumber or the painter are doing their things, but I think when they do their work, they both get a good feeling from it.

Maybe "charity" is not the right word (sorry I am not english). well that's my perception of life: everybody tries to fullfill it on the personal, social and professional level. most of us have the desire to share their love with others and everyone does it in a different and not necessarily unique way: loving your children, partner, doing a job you consider useful to others... it is not systematic, but if you don't get the chance to share your love this way, you can decide to take action and help others the best way you can.

I hope this message is understandable. I am happy to see that you both contribute to these subtitles as a genuine gesture for others.

I remain impressed by your dedication. Do you get a lot of thank you messages or it’s quite rare?

[Hunnenkoenig]

When I started translating, I translated PC games about 10-15 years ago.
I became "famous" pretty quick in gamer circles and I liked it to be honest.
I received many thanks and I had the feeling, that people saw something special in me.

I stopped translating games eventually, because it is always a very big undertaking, but I still enjoy translating. I don't know why really. I just like languages.

Later on I was asked to help out translating a movie and I enjoyed it. I then realized, how many young people without real knowledge about english and my mother tongue do this and I started to pick up movies, which I liked and didn't want to be messed up by these guys.

I never ever received any thanking notes per email even if I always add my email address to the subtitles at the behginning or at the end.

I received a few critics or suggestions per email and some gratulations, but I think, I can count them all on one hand.

I received another couple thanks on forums or here in comments.
That's all.

So I don't really know why I am doing this :-)
I think it is everything a little bit in it.

[SmallBrother]

I just did a quick statistical count of my uploads, a bit more than 100 subtitles were downloaded in total 120,000 times, average of 1000 per subtitle.
I got one thank you for a subtitle I made on request and another thank you 'spontaneously'.

Haha, pretty funny, eh

I guess people are not very easy with saying thanks. On the other hand, if I look at the comments on subtitles here on OpenSubtitles.org, I conclude that it's much easier to say some subtitle is cr@p. But another statistical count: I never got shlt about the subtitles I uploaded, so I guess I'm doing okay

[Hunnenkoenig]

btw funny fact: I was even banned on one forum once, because the admin meant, I have to follow his orders how to translate something and I have no right to say otherwise. He called me an @$$hole, because I said, that I do a freelance work for others, not for him and I don't have to upload my translations to his site for him to benefit from it.

He meant, I should then upload on OpenSubtitles.org for idiots.

Since then I upload my translations only here. :-)

[hector]

I came upon this topic while looking for something else. I think this is a very interesting question.

Personally, I find myself very close to SmallBrother's motivations. These are mine in order of relevance:

1. It is fun. I like computers and languages so this is a good way of spending my spare time.
2. Self esteem. Yes, I feel good doing useful (I want to think it is useful) things. The more effort you invest, the more good you feel.
3. Sharing knowledge. I think sharing is a good thing. I've been profiting from others' work. I think I must contribute somehow to this wealth.

I usually make subtitles for films that I find interesting for some reason. Making subtitles is fun but better if there's something more.

[hector]

I just did a quick statistical count of my uploads, a bit more than 100 subtitles were downloaded in total 120,000 times, average of 1000 per subtitle.
I got one thank you for a subtitle I made on request and another thank you 'spontaneously'.

Haha, pretty funny, eh ;-)

I guess people are not very easy with saying thanks. On the other hand, if I look at the comments on subtitles here on OpenSubtitles.org, I conclude that it's much easier to say some subtitle is cr@p. But another statistical count: I never got shlt about the subtitles I uploaded, so I guess I'm doing okay :)

Yeah, I got one "thank you" in 1,000 downloads, so my ratio is much better :-)
And yes, I totally agree: it seems easier to throw shit than thanks. Anyway I think this button is a good idea. I'll try to use it more often.

[NDROK]

SmallBro,

is written in a book l4pis reproba1us capu1 anguli!
I read your email roughly one year ago and this evening I read it again, as I learnt to become slowly in the judgement. Also in this case, as one year ago I have to say that your post is the most human i ever read in my long virtual life.
I am kinda socialist but I believe in a bigger not human intelligence that rule the world, and I sincerely hope that this entity could bless you and all the people that do this amazing work. When I was low income student I could see a lot of really smart movies because of the subtitles, these movies opened my conscience, these movies made me smarter, these movies made me learn the English language, improve my French, Spanish and Dutch, these movies gave me the possibility to go away from my country stricken by the crisis and to find a job (also based on the books i downloaded for free), these movies increased my IQ, and relaxed me making possible to make university exams. A person called Plato said some year ago that the philosophers would be the best governor of a city, but that they do not want to govern a city. This appear to me that there is still hope. Not to make a world better as some tagged associations want, but to make still people like me dedicate a thought, a thank you, that not need to be written, because is in the air, the same air that everybody breath:.
Breath, as Bread as real Brother

[SmallBrother]

That's a beautiful thank-you, NDROK.
Thank you.

[kerremelk]

Hi,
zou het kunnen dat jullie afgaan op het getal dat 'thanked subtitles" weergeeft in uw profiel?
Dat staat op (bvb) 10 als je zelf 10 bedankjes GAF, en telt dus niet het aantal bedankjes dat je kreeg noch het aantal ondertitels waarvoor je bedankjes kreeg.

Als dat dan al geteld moet worden... is het nog de vraag:
Je kan bvb voor een enkele ondertitel tientallen dankuwelletjes krijgen, moeten die opgeteld worden?
Of, heeft men beter zicht op kwaliteit als het aantal titels geteld zou worden waarop bedank(jes) voorkomen?

Het eerste zou veeleer een indicatie kunnen zijn over de populariteit van een film (38 bedankjes voor enkele duizenden dowloads geeft "iets" aan, maar hoe je dat interpreteert blijft wel open.

Het tweede kan ergens wel duiden op het percentage van titels tov uploaded titels dat een duimpje kreeg voor...

tja, die bedankjes of duimpjes, voor wat eigenlijk?
- kwaliteit?
- eindelijk ene die op mijn film juist loopt?
- eindelijk gevonden tout court- omdat ik elders niks vond - en al blij dat het leesbaar was?

Nu weet ik dat er ook een sterrensysteem loopt.
Hoe nuttig wordt dit?
Ondertitels die Sinds invoeging ervan quotering kregen zullen gaandeweg wel opvallen, maar ook hier kan men zich afvragen hoe je dit gegeven kan 'quantificeren'/benutten.
Ik zou zelfs denken dat serverload onder zulke features begint te kreunen.

OOPS.
in English please.

Hi,
could it be you refer to the number shown in profile that says "thanked subtitles"?
That number counts the titles YOU gave a thankyou to.
It says (eg.) 10 if you GAVE THX to ten titles, and there is no counter for the mumber of thanks you got for your uploaded titles.
This begs the question, must this be counted? And if it gets counted, in what manner?
One could get dozens of THX on one title. Must these be totalled?
Or, for quality evaluation purposes, does one count the number ot thanked titles?

The former could be indicative about the popularity of a movie.
(38 THX on a title that has thousands of downloads indicates something, but what it indicates is an open question.)

The latter might tell you something about the avarage quality.
(eg, 38 out of all your uploads got a thankyou. one gets some percentage...)

So, if one counts the thankyous/thumbs up one recieves, what will it mean?
- Quality?
- At last one that runs fine with my film?
- At last, I find a subtitle, and it is bearable?

I realise there is also a star system.
How useful will this become?
Subtitles that got a star evaluation will, through time, become noticed.
Those data can be interpreted many ways (older films from Pre-star-era had a download count before the implementation or quality evaluation with stars. Will it differentiate pre/since counts, and if it does, is this useful or not?
(I am sure there are more angles and variations possible as to how one can interpret those data. )

My take in all this is that the more features one adds to the site, the heavier the load becomes.
Data crunching causes data traffic in the server's memory before the page loads.
Stuff like that could be useful to users, but how useful it really is is in the grey area of statistics and quantification.

'nuff said for today.
jt

[hector]

So, if one counts the thankyous/thumbs up one recieves, what will it mean?
- Quality?
- At last one that runs fine with my film?
- At last, I find a subtitle, and it is bearable?

I don't think it means quality. For that you have the "vote for subtitles". I think it is more an indicative of the popularity of the film. Besides, if you think thoroughly about it, the kind of films one person watches say something about his/her personality, so you could say there is a correlation between the kind of film and the number of thanks. I don't know. What I know is that I like to see "X thanks received" in my subtitle page.

I can tell you I've received many thanks for a low quality work. I always try to do my best but this was one of my first subtitles and it wasn't very good quality. It had many typos and bad timings. But people thanked me anyway. As somebody said it's better to have a low quality subtitle than nothing at all.

So, I would choose the 3rd option.