Who is explosiveskull?

[suadnovic]

Who is explosiveskull to do such things?
https://www.opensubtitles.org/en/subtit ... -or-not-en
This isn't irst time he behave like this. I corrected subtitle from torrent, and author is removed, NOT MY FAULT. Original subtite has 1169 lines, mine 944. So, this gay is spiting on my efford. Is he some kind of protected animal, or what?
BTW, in subtititle I worked on, I didn't put my signature. Fair enough on my part.

[SmallBrother]

In general I prefer not to interfere with other language sections and/or evaluating the actions of other admins. But another admin has asked me to investigate and reply. So here it is.

First of all, please keep calm and be careful with choosing words. "Animal" could be taken the wrong way. Also "gay" (= homosexual) - although I assume this is just a spelling mistake and you probably just mean "guy" (= male person).

I compared the subtitles:
- The upload of explosiveskull of 20-Nov-2019 23:08:24 for Ready.Or.Not.2019.720p.BluRay.x264-[YTS.LT]
- Your upload of 23-Nov-2019 09:34:12 for Ready.or.Not.2019.BRRip.XviD.MP3-XVID
Disabled with comment "Dupe with the credits removed. Please refrain from uploading this subtitle again, it\'s a stolen subtitle and no efforts other than extracting it from a video file were made for it: https://www.opensubtitles.org/en/subtit ... -or-not-en"

These are my findings:
- The original source is indeed the subs of explosiveskull. And credits are missing.
- Subs are not exactly duplicate. You did make a lot of changes, mainly merging lines.

Note:
- It is NOT said that YOU stole the subtitles or that YOU removed the credits, just that they were stolen (by 'someone') and credits removed (by 'someone'). But fact is that credits are missing and this is enough reason to disable the subtitles.
- You did make a lot of changes, so the statement "no efforts other than extracting it from a video file were made for it" is not correct.
- IF credits were present, maybe a significantly different subtitle could stay or even be an update for the existing subtitle, but only if the second version is actually better.

In this case, I don't think your version is better. The changes you made, were merging a lot of lines. Sometimes, it can be better to merge two short lines into one longer line. But in your version they are often resulting in dialogues starting halfway one line. For example:
Original:

Code: Select all

12 00:02:31,451 --> 00:02:32,419 No, Charles! Stop! 13 00:02:32,519 --> 00:02:34,322 - Helene! - No, please, stop it!

Your version:

Code: Select all

8 00:02:31,451 --> 00:02:34,322 No, Charles! Stop! - Helene! - No, please, stop it!

Or just changing the formatting.
Original:

Code: Select all

53 00:04:39,180 --> 00:04:42,717 - Yeah. - They're used to a three-year courtship.

Your version:

Code: Select all

40 00:04:39,180 --> 00:04:42,781 Yeah. - They're used to a three-year courtship.

This method is very confusing and should not be done.
Line 30 is even worse, having possibly even three speakers on one line:

Code: Select all

"Moderately"? That's pretty generous. - Hi. - Hey.

I remember a discussion about this some time ago here on the forum. If you prefer this way, that's fine. But it is violating very elementary general subtitling guidelines and should never be done.

In short:
- Credits were missing. Enough reason to disable.
- Your version is not better, but worse. No reason to keep this version or to add credits to it.

My conclusion:
- Explosiveskull did the right thing by disabling your subs.
- Explosiveskull could have looked and explained better about the differences.

[oss]

SmallBrother you should rename to Sherlock Homes Thanks for work

[suadnovic]

Thanks for comprehensive answer. I will tray additionaly to explain my "complain".
First of all, I greatly appreciate his work, without his subtitles wouldn't be a.e. serban subtitles, what interests me most. But, his subtitles isn't perfect (to many lines), so I think he must correct himself in this direction. My processing of bambula's serbian subtitle (no doubt made after his)
https://www.opensubtitles.org/en/subtit ... -or-not-sr
has even less lines, 803.
I tried once to contact him at https://subscene.com/, he didn't answer me. Just what I became from he somewhere was his "advice" to stick at serbian subtitle. Decent? I wouldn't say. If he thinks he doesn't need good-faith advice, let sign his subtitle with explosiveskull magnificent, and end of story.
I'm sarcastic little, and this is in connection with my term "animal". I see he is moderator here, a little half-tronic signed his subtitle with https://www.opensubtitles.org/, maybe ftom gratitude...
I wonder myself about right reasons his wsh to be admin here. If it s to protect his work, then that is shameful.
And finally, "gay" is tipping mistake, it didn't happen to me the first time, on one forum I was laughing theme for months.
He should not deny anyone's work on improving anybodys subtitles, least of your own, if he have good intentions. And without false modesty, I can say that my BH processed subtitles have their customers. So, I ask to be proteced animal, too.

[SmallBrother]

Sorry, it was not and will not be my intention to evaluate a colleague admin. I leave it up to explosiveskull to react to the things you say - or not.

But I do want to emphasize one more thing about your subs. Please allow me to be a straight gay, I mean a straight guy

You are talking about corrections and the subs not being good, mainly for too many lines. Sure, any self-respecting subtitler, especially admin, should be open for criticism and improvements on his work. But I don't think your subs are better and your criticism is not right. Your subs are worse.

Every language has a different set of guidelines how good subtitles should be. I am Dutch and specialized in Dutch subtitles and I know less about English guidelines. But let me give you a small example. In Dutch, dialogues only have a hyphen ("-") on the second line, for the second speaker, NOT on the first line. In English however, it is common to have a dialogue hyphen on BOTH lines, for BOTH speakers. Now imagine, I upload my version of English subtitles with only ONE dialogue hyphen. Basically, setting DUTCH standard on ENGLISH subtitles. This is not making the subs better, but worse. Obviously this example is not a huge difference, subs will still be bearable, but surely it is not BETTER.

I know utterly nothing about Serbian-specific guidelines. But I cannot imagine, actually for ANY language, having a dialogue on ONE line is an improvement or a standard. Maybe in Serbian it is, but NOT in Dutch and NOT in English. So even IF you are right for Serbian subtitles, you cannot apply this to English subtitles.

Further I think your method of subtitling/correcting is setting too much weight to some ideas (whether good or bad) and overruling too much other ideas, which in my opinion are more important. Once again, maybe this is normal in Serbian, or maybe it is just your personal preference, but anyway, you should NOT set these standards to subs in other languages. And definitely you should not see this as improvement.

[explosiveskull]

Okay. Originally, I didn't want to reply you here because I thought the explanation I gave in the subtitle page was enough, but you're doing wrong things and expect us to be okay with them.

First of all, when I refer you to the original subtitle, that means now you're aware the subtitle was stolen, so missing credits is enough reason to take your version down.

Secondly, you have pretty much damaged the subtitle in every possible way as SmallBrother pointed out, so even if we were okay with not including the original credits, your changes weren't really "improvements". I highly recommend you look up the subtitling standards some known companies take into account while creating subtitles. Netflix's captioning studio standards set is a good one to look at: https://partnerhelp.netflixstudios.com/ ... quirements

Have a good evening!

[suadnovic]

In my earlier work, I searated, at any costs dialogs in long lines at 2:
First spoken...
- Second spoken.
Then I realise it's wrong, because offten to short duration. Result, I'm chesting subtitles, insteed to watch movie. It's much pleasent for my eye to join 2 or even more short lines, at cost of appearance second dalog at first row.
Next I watch movie, don't make language thesis, right language doesn't matter to me, I pick what is pleasent to me.
Ready.or.Not.2019.BRRip.XviD.MP3-XVID is easy to find and see I didn't stole nothing.
For reducing subtitle, I use program Subtitle Merger, and my frend, your EVERY subtitle can be shortened. I say to you this in best intention.
And at age of 65, I haven't ambition to master my english. I see no purpose.
Let's conclude this with
"De gustibus non disputandum est"
Cheers.

[SmallBrother]

Sorry suadnovic, but it looks like you don't seem to understand.

I pick what is pleasent to me.

Okay. Pleasant to YOU. But that doesnt mean pleasant to ALL. On the contrary, NOT pleasant to MOST.

"De gustibus non disputandum est"

Fair enough. But some things are not "opinions". Once again, feel free to change subs to suit your own needs or opinions. But for personal use only.

Because, in my opinion, tomorrow the sun will not shine.
But it will.
Well, not in the Netherlands, but that's another story

[scooby007]

Hello suadnovic,

I see he is moderator here, a little half-tronic signed his subtitle with https://www.opensubtitles.org/, maybe ftom gratitude..

He's actually had that signature before becoming an admin, but meh.

I wonder myself about right reasons his wsh to be admin here. If it s to protect his work, then that is shameful.

If that is the reason for any admin to become admin, then that would be shameful. Admins that don't do basic admin work and only protect their work are removed from being an administrator. This shouldn't be the public's worry, but ours. And we do take action, if need be.
Explosiveskull is more than aware of our rules for being an admin.

And without false modesty, I can say that my BH processed subtitles have their customers. So, I ask to be proteced animal, too.

He is not a protected "animal" and nor am I.
No admin or user is, so how can you be?

And finally, "gay" is tipping mistake, it didn't happen to me the first time, on one forum I was laughing theme for months.

And hopefully will remain a treat for our eyes for many months too.

It's much pleasent for my eye to join 2 or even more short lines, at cost of appearance second dalog at first row. I pick what is pleasent to me.

SB likes giving his life experience lessons, as do I.
When I first came on the scene, I used to remove all grammar punctuations, commas and fullstops. This is/was wrong. I was a teenager in the 90's with mobile phones handed to us and the craze of text messages galore. Ah, the glory days of my long lost youth.
This "text message" way of writing was what I wanted to bring to subtitles because it "was pleasing to my eyes," but it was still wrong. There is a standard, and that standard needs to be met.
Explosiveskull might be new to admin duties, but he's certainly not new to the subtitling making industry. And knows how to make a subtitle.

You obviously took some time doing what you did, so for that I thank you for the effort, first and foremost.
But if a retail standard subtitle already exists on the database for your release in the English section, then please don't change that to your liking and reupload it. Keep it for your personal use. It will not benefit other English speaking users who have a subtitle already available to the required English standards and layout.
Do as you wish in other languages, Dutch included.
Incidentally, that's a joke, before SB flips.

Changing things to our personal liking doesn't make something an improvement, but only by adhering and improving to standard set protocols does.
Existing subtitles in the database with credits in them being reuploaded without credits and improved to normal standard language protocols will be kept and uploaded as version 2 with the correct/missing credits applied.
Machine translations or subtitles that have been made worse than before, minus the credits, will almost certainly be removed. Always.

I know you didn't remove the credits, that is the fault of the torrent suppliers, but the following is a general ruling for credits for anyone else that may read this topic: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=15787

As nothing wrong has been done by our admins on this occasion, this matter should now rest.

Have a good day.

[SmallBrother]

Do as you wish in other languages, Dutch included.
Incidentally, that's a joke, before SB flips.

Thank god

As nothing wrong has been done by our admins on this occasion, this matter should now rest.

Yes, please.

[Martin1964]

I feel all is very simple:

- If you correct and/or resync a subtitle originally by some other person (explosiveskull or not) = name the original uploader
- No matter the time taken to correct and/or resync a subtitle = name the original uploader
- If you upload sync and/or correct an original subtitle but mess up = might be deleted
- Nobody can ask to be a admin or moderator, wait for an invitation!

Have a great day!

[hadilan]

***explosiveskull*** aka ***ES***; "King of The Subs" and respect King's works

[suadnovic]

Ok, once again about "problem". Let's see subtitle
https://www.opensubtitles.org/en/subtit ... rishman-en
He have 3564 lines. My serbian subtitle have 2744 lines (joined fast changing dialogs). I even saw a subtitle that has about 1800 lines. I suggest translators, after finished job, to put subtitle through Subtitle Merger,
https://sourceforge.net/projects/zsubtitlemerger/
and see what he will say. It's not the same if I say something to someone, when they see it with their own eyes.
And whatever explosiveskull say, subtitle shortened from 3500 lines to 1800 is a new subtitle, it doesn't matter if someone thinks he's good or bad. Whether or not the repairman will leave the original author's signature is a matter of personal nature.

[SmallBrother]

He have 3564 lines. My serbian subtitle have 2744 lines (joined fast changing dialogs). I even saw a subtitle that has about 1800 lines.

Yes, then the subs are different. But once again, less lines is not necessarily better. On the contrary, I have seen subs getting (really significantly) worse. But it is up to the admins to decide what to with it, depending on the language specific policies. And there is no point in repeating the same discussion.

Whether or not the repairman will leave the original author's signature is a matter of personal nature.

This is absolutely not up to the repair man. If the subtitle was derived from another existing subtitle, credits must remain.
See the forum topic about credits: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=15787

Specifically:
- Existing credits for translation or editing within the subtitles should remain unchanged.
Always. Also if you changed or corrected things. Also if those were a lot. Also if that took a lot of time.