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hector
Posts: 335
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 12:27 pm
Location: Spain

shouldn't checksums be discarded on updates?

Thu Aug 09, 2018 10:24 am

Hi.
Recently I updated a subtitle (https://www.opensubtitles.org/en/subtitles/5697914/all-that-heaven-allows-en) and then I noticed it had checksums (the yellow star beside the title). Since I updated the timings the result is that the film doesn't match anymore. The change was a simple shift, that is to say, I added some fixed amount to the timings. But I guess the checksums are obsolete now anyway.

Since I always use web interface there's nothing I can do about this, is there?

By the way (I know it's off-topic but...) this happens because I took (I was given the ownership) an old anonymous subtitle. It was full of OCR and grammatical errors so I thought there was no point in uploading a new version and keeping this. Just to reduce somehow what I call OSM (opensubtitles mess :-)

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SmallBrother
Site Admin
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Location: Somewhere on this globe

Re: shouldn't checksums be discarded on updates?

Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:19 pm

An admin could remove those wrong hash codes.
But...
I understand your thinking, but updating should only be done to FIX errors (corrections in text, synchronisation, CPS related rewritings and merging/splitting, etc.) but NOT to CHANGE to another release. You just found out the reason why ;-)

In this case the way should have been:
- Fix those OCR errors, but keep the synchronisation matching the YIFY videos.
- Then uploading this subtitle as v2.
Now there is one subtitle, without OCR errors and the hashcodes / movie file names are matching.
OR
- Fix those OCR errors, and changing the sync to any other release.
- Do a fresh new separate upload.
- Report the old subs with many OCR errors to be deleted for that reason.
Now there is one good subtitle, just for a different video.
OR
The best would be doing both ;-)
Then there will be TWO good subs for two different releases.

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hector
Posts: 335
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 12:27 pm
Location: Spain

Re: shouldn't checksums be discarded on updates?

Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:11 pm

Yeah, I found the reason why but it was too late :-(

Perhaps the key here is anonymous uploads. Can anonymous subtitles be updated? I think they should be updatable by everybody since no one owns them. A sort of "public domain" subtitle. The reality is that they are not updatable by anybody.

I still don't understand the point in allowing anonymous uploads. The account is free and easy to acquire. Why then? The result is loads of bad subtitles that can't be changed/improved.

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SmallBrother
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Re: shouldn't checksums be discarded on updates?

Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:35 pm

hector wrote:Yeah, I found the reason why but it was too late :-(

It's never too late :)
You could update that subtitle with a version that is again suitable for the given movie names
All.That.Heaven.Allows.1955.720p.BluRay.x264.YIFY.mp4
All.That.Heaven.Allows.1955.1080p.BluRay.x264.YIFY.mp4
OR
you could ask an admin to delete those hashes.

Preferably the first option, otherwise the hashes will be gone - a pity.
And the best would be to upload the subs for version 720p.BluRay.x264-HD4U [PublicHD] separately, and of course using software which includes the hash.

hector wrote:Perhaps the key here is anonymous uploads. Can anonymous subtitles be updated? I think they should be updatable by everybody since no one owns them. A sort of "public domain" subtitle. The reality is that they are not updatable by anybody.

Anonymous subs can be updated by admins. I think it is NOT a good idea if anonymous subs can be updated by anybody, because not everybody is as sharp as you are. I think probably most are not. Making anonymous subs "public domain" as in 'do what you want', things will turn out exactly like that. The subs will be mass-raped.

This is how I do it / how it happens sometimes:
- An anonymous subtitle is not very good.
- An improved version appears.
- Admin takes that improved version and updates the old 'bad' version.
Reality is that the vast majority of subtitles are not being improved. Or they are changed by users thinking they are improvements but actually are not...

Actually, the same thing can/does happen with subs with 'ownership', when the improvements are done by someone else than the initial uploader.

hector wrote:I still don't understand the point in allowing anonymous uploads. The account is free and easy to acquire. Why then? The result is loads of bad subtitles that can't be changed/improved.

As said, anonymous subs can be changed/improved. Also, having only subs with ownership does not mean they will be improved better or more often. For the users: remaining anonymous is easier than registering. Allowing anonymous subs just increases uploads - and yes, quite some of those are not so good or plain trash. In some languages sections uploads which are anonymous AND automated (API) are disabled.

User avatar
hector
Posts: 335
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 12:27 pm
Location: Spain

Re: shouldn't checksums be discarded on updates?

Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:20 pm

SmallBrother wrote:It's never too late :)
You could update that subtitle with a version that is again suitable for the given movie names
All.That.Heaven.Allows.1955.720p.BluRay.x264.YIFY.mp4
All.That.Heaven.Allows.1955.1080p.BluRay.x264.YIFY.mp4


OK. I'll do it as soon as I can remember whether that second was subtracted or added.

Thanks for your reply.

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SmallBrother
Site Admin
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Re: shouldn't checksums be discarded on updates?

Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:42 pm

Depending on your internet connection speed, it may be faster (and/or easier) to download that YIFY video.

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